Jan 3 – 9:05am - We sent a Happy New Year email to Bill Collins

Jan 3 – 4:08pm – Bill responded saying he would be interested in talking to us about the future of armwrestling

Jan 21 – 4:54pm – We emailed Bill saying we’d love to talk to him could he possibly come to Kevin Hicklin’s event as we knew Kevin had invited him to come

Feb 8 – 8:27am – We emailed Bill since we had not received a response to our Jan 21 email to make sure he had received it

Feb 8 – 1:26pm – We private messaged Bill the same as the email above

Feb 8 – 6:30pm – Bill responded by email saying he had left us a private message on the NE board

Feb 8 – 3:56pm – Bill’s private message states “I did get your email and I deleted with out noticing”, “My objective is to join both of us under one roof and change armwrestling history”, “how do we bring it together??”,  “what is it going to take for AAA & USA to work together”

Feb 9 – 10:44am – Private message to Bill telling him we were leaving out of town, had 4 hour drive each way to Hicklin event and would have some answers for him when we got back

We met with Leonard, Denise, and Dave in Vegas a couple of years ago as you are aware. We agreed for all of us to work together if the 2 WAF's could come together. It was a simple agreement whereby we would use both National events as qualifiers for the U.S. World Team. 1st place winners from each would qualify. If, for example, the AAA National champion could not fill the slot in a class, we would go down the line from the AAA Nationals to fill it. If we could not fill the class, then we would offer it to the USA to fill from the pullers in the same class.

Too simple? Yes, it is. No hidden agendas, no deep dark plots, just simply utilizing ALL the resources the United States has. After all, remember, the competitors are NOT representing the American Armsport Association or the United States Armsports, they are representing the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

Both events are well established in this country. This year will be the 40th anniversary of the AAA National Championship. 40 years worth of history and being completely honest, we will not just throw all that away. If we used both Nationals, it benefits the armwrestlers. For years, the AAA held two Nationals each year, a stand up and a sit down, and we qualified for the US team from both. First and foremost, it gives all the competitors the opportunity of 2 chances to be on the US team. Second, it gives all the armwrestlers the opportunity to save some money. We have no problem in agreeing to let's say, split the United States in half - the AAA will hold Nationals from the center to the eastern half, and the USA will hold Nationals from the center to the western half. The travel costs for the competitors to attend the Nationals that is closest to them would be minimal, thus saving money to apply to their world trip should they qualify. As a result, we could possibly see a US World Team filled with nothing but 1st place winners, or at least the definite "top" armwrestlers. Both Nationals are also far enough apart time wise that the competitors can and will attend both.

Of course, we would have to change our weight classes which wouldn't be a problem. And, we are also offering for the United States Armsports qualifier to qualify for disabled divisions on the USA World Team.

As far as the world Congress meeting, again to be completely honest, WE COULD CARE LESS!!! Contrary to the rhetoric that was spread after our agreement with Leonard, Denise, and Dave was no longer honored, there was no tug of war or power struggle as to who would or would not attend the meetings. We have attended meetings for 20 years now, have had to deal with all the politics, and have long ago had our fill. Of course we want to be included as to what issues the United States might put on the agenda and/or how the United States will vote on any agenda items but that's it!

The whole thing is really simple. Too simple maybe since we're all supposed to be in this huge fight for dominance - or at least that's what the gossip mongers say, but we believe it can and will work. All we have to do is agree to work with you guys and you guys agree to work with us.

So, what do you think?

Feb 24 – 6:26pm – Private message from Bill  saying he’d been taking care of priorities at home and was “busier than a one legged man in a butt kicking contest and had not forgotten about us”

March 8 – 7:19am – Private message to Bill Collins checking on our proposal, asking if he had finished “kicking butts”

March 8 – 8:25am – Private message from Bill saying he was “catching up with issues and “I be chatting with you soon”

March 16 – 11:32am – Private message to Bill Collins saying we need an answer to our proposal, we need to tell our WAF something

March 16 – 9:56pm - Private message from Bill Collins saying “My objective to get you on board with USA.”, “from what I've heard (one side of the story) the board has mad a proposal to AAA and your comment was AAA will never work or be part of USA.”, “whats in the past is in the past some can let it go and some can not.”, “give me an idea what your proposing and I'll work angles to see what the board will and will not approve.”

Too funny - first of all, the "comment" regarding joining USA happened when we had our meeting in Vegas. We were putting a proposal to our WAF for both WAF's to work together and needed to be able to have something set up in the US if our group had agreed. So, we put our proposal on the table to Dave, Leonard, and Denise for us to join together by taking one competitor from the AAA Nationals and one competitor from the Unified Nationals for the US Team each year IF both WAF's accepted the proposal we had for one world organization. Second, Denise kept insisting we just join USA and use the Unifieds only. We kept telling her that there was way too many years of armwrestling history in the AAA Nationals especially since the AAA Nationals was the first and had been the only way to qualify for the team for world from the beginning. Finally, Frank said - "we're not joining USA, ok" That was the "comment"! Then, Dave, Leonard, and Denise signed an agreement with Frank and me to use both Nationals as "qualifiers" for the US team. So, see Bill, this has already been agreed upon once! And, since it's been agreed upon once, why not twice? And, make twice actually last and hold up since the first time, Denise cratered the agreement not even 6 weeks later.

Anyway - here's our proposal again. This is what I sent you on Feb 16 (if you still have it in your pm's). I've copied it below:
We met with Leonard, Denise, and Dave in Vegas a couple of years ago as you are aware. We agreed for all of us to work together if the 2 WAF's could come together. It was a simple agreement whereby we would use both National events as qualifiers for the U.S. World Team. 1st place winners from each would qualify. If, for example, the AAA National champion could not fill the slot in a class, we would go down the line from the AAA Nationals to fill it. If we could not fill the class, then we would offer it to the USA to fill from the pullers in the same class.

Too simple? Yes, it is. No hidden agendas, no deep dark plots, just simply utilizing ALL the resources the United States has. After all, remember, the competitors are NOT representing the American Armsport Association or the United States Armsports, they are representing the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

Both events are well established in this country. This year will be the 40th anniversary of the AAA National Championship. 40 years worth of history and being completely honest, we will not just throw all that away. If we used both Nationals, it benefits the armwrestlers. For years, the AAA held two Nationals each year, a stand up and a sit down, and we qualified for the US team from both. First and foremost, it gives all the competitors the opportunity of 2 chances to be on the US team. Second, it gives all the armwrestlers the opportunity to save some money. We have no problem in agreeing to let's say, split the United States in half - the AAA will hold Nationals from the center to the eastern half, and the USA will hold Nationals from the center to the western half. The travel costs for the competitors to attend the Nationals that is closest to them would be minimal, thus saving money to apply to their world trip should they qualify. As a result, we could possibly see a US World Team filled with nothing but 1st place winners, or at least the definite "top" armwrestlers. Both Nationals are also far enough apart time wise that the competitors can and will attend both.

Of course, we would have to change our weight classes which wouldn't be a problem. And, we are also offering for the United States Armsports qualifier to qualify for disabled divisions on the USA World Team.

As far as the world Congress meeting, again to be completely honest, WE COULD CARE LESS!!! Contrary to the rhetoric that was spread after our agreement with Leonard, Denise, and Dave was no longer honored, there was no tug of war or power struggle as to who would or would not attend the meetings. We have attended meetings for 20 years now, have had to deal with all the politics, and have long ago had our fill. Of course we want to be included as to what issues the United States might put on the agenda and/or how the United States will vote on any agenda items but that's it!

The whole thing is really simple. Too simple maybe since we're all supposed to be in this huge fight for dominance - or at least that's what the gossip mongers say, but we believe it can and will work. All we have to do is agree to work with you guys and you guys agree to work with us.

So, what do you think?
 

Now let me add a few things. The AAA has in place, a means to pay not only the WAF dues of $300 each year but also our competitor's entry fees. We will continue to do that under this new agreement. It is our understanding that the USA pays ONLY the WAF dues each year and they do so off of receiving one half of the profits from the Unified Nationals. By us paying the WAF dues and the entry fees of the competitors that qualify from the AAA Nationals, money shouldn't be an issue. Plus, we, the AAA have NEVER had to have our US team members pay their own entry fees.

This is really simple Bill. Nobody taking over anybody. Nobody losing anything. Simply using as many resources as possible to benefit the competitors. If our athletes can save money by attending a qualifying Nationals that's close to them, then they can use the money saved to put toward going to the world championships. And, IF everyone is truely "for the sport" there shouldn't be a problem. Bottom line here is the athletes benefit and that's all that should really matter.

Also, as I sent you in a pm yesterday - our WAF is waiting to see what we do here in the US before proceeding. IF we can come to an agreement for the 2 US entities to work together, IF basically you, as President of USA, can ink a deal between the AAA and the USA, you will basically be inking a deal between the 2 WAF's.

Our only problem here is time. Time is running extremely short and we have to make a decision. We're getting pressure from our WAF members since basically things have been put on hold waiting on us.

So basically it comes down to whether the USA can agree to basically the same agreement they agreed to a couple of years ago with us or not with some new added benefits.

What do ya think?

March 20 – 4:18pm – Email to Bill Collins saying “our "items" are what we responded to you with.  You asked what would it take to get together and we answered how we thought it could work”, “we don't understand what it is you are asking us”, “you asked what would it take, we answered, and we have been waiting for a response from USA.”

March 20 – 4:41pm – Email to Bill Collins saying “are you wanting us to take our response to you and break it down into numbered items for you to present to the USA board for them to vote on?”

March 21 – 11:55am – Email from Bill Collins saying “Can you please express in a sequence form what you’re proposing (new or old proposals) and I’ll present them.”

We were previously offered the following from United States Armsports:
1. Three positions/votes on the Executive Board of the United States Armsports.
2. The opportunity to submit a bid for the USA Unified National Championship each year.
3. The AAA may continue to charge their membership fee of $25 to participate in the USA Unified National Championship should they be awarded the bid.
4.  The opportunity to post events, results and pictures on www.armwrestling.com.
5. All other benefits offered to all our member associations
In addition to the above items, we would also like to have the following agreed upon:
1. All current AAA scoring personnel be accepted and used as official scoring personnel at the Unified Nationals along with current USA personnel.
2. All current AAA weigh in/registration personnel be accepted and used as official weigh in/registration personnel at the Unified Nationals along with current USA personnel.
3. All current AAA refereeing personnel be accepted and used as official refereeing personnel at the Unified Nationals along with current USA personnel.
4. Any AAA Executive Board members of United States Armsports may have full proxy voting rights for each other in the event of absence during any meeting where any subject is voted upon.

March 27 – 3:59pm – Email from Bill Collins asking “Is there any interest you going USA as a member association?”

March 27 – 4:22pm – Email to Bill Collins asking “Wouldn't we automatically be a member of USA if Frank and I are on the Board?  Has the Board voted on our proposal?”

March 27 – 4:40pm – Email from Bill Collins saying “Actually, to present a proposal to the board you have to be a member association, I presented your proposal anyway, but a question was asked about you joining USA as a member.”

March 29 – 3:34pm – Email responding to Bill Collins “Regarding the USA membership, absolutely the AAA would join USA as a member if we're going to be on the Board.  We (AAA) also have numerous organizations under our banner that would also join USA as well.  This will be something for the history books if we can all work together to make the United States truly the biggest and best in the world.  We feel we all can do it.  Like any partnership, it takes work to achieve greatness.

Let us know when you know.  Thanks for your consideration.”

March 30 – 10:57am – Email from Bill Collins “I don’t want this to sound like I’m throwing up dirt, the USA constitution is a protocol that shall be carried out from the USA board. Before a proposal is accepted from an association, that association is a USA member, as it states below (Article six). I did submit your proposal for discussion and it is not ignored.
Article Six - Executive Board of Directors
c) Additional Members may be appointed to the Executive Board from other member associations by a 2/3 vote of the current Executive Board members.
I shall keep you informed on issues that are addressable, here is a membership form for your consideration, to join USA”

March 31 – 7:01am – Email to Bill Collins “Can you please explain what you have sent us?”

Apr 3 – 10:48am – Email from Bill Collins “
Hello Karen,
I forwarded your proposal to the USA board for discussion and I have sent you the membership form to become a member association of USA. At this point, I’m sorry to inform you the motion to vote on the AAA as Executive Board Members is in direct conflict with our current bylaws (Article Six).  As such this motion cannot even be voted upon until such time as the AAA is a USA member.”
 

NOTE:  We have since found that Mr. Collins NEVER submitted our first or second proposal to the Executive Committee of United States Armsports.
 
 

Back to Home Page
 
 
 

WTC Mesothelioma